Marko Slivenko

WSUS replacement

Been wanting to replace WSUS for server updates with something more "modern". We've been testing NinjaOne, but not sure it's the one for us. With WSUS, we approved the updates, servers download them and then we'd manually install them/reboot.
Anyone else managing updates with N1? How's it going for you?
Other option, just stick with WSUS for another 5 years or so.

1

Responses

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Rania Brodahl
Rania Brodahl
@sadpanda698294 · Jan 12, 2026 9:38 am

the way this is presented changes how it lands which explains why reactions are split We’ll see how people react over time.

Talisa De Bekker
Talisa De Bekker
@angrymeercat721406 · Jan 12, 2026 9:32 am

Real talk, this depends heavily on what happens next which is why this is getting picked apart That part stands out. We’ll see how people react over time. Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Elias Blanc
Elias Blanc
@greenzebra248311 · Jan 12, 2026 9:32 am

If we’re being honest, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so so the response doesn’t surprise me That’s what changes the context. We’ll see how people react over time.

Siiri Palo
Siiri Palo
@angryelephant385921 · Jan 12, 2026 9:30 am

Stepping back, the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here which makes the reaction pretty predictable Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Prebislav Haritonenko
Prebislav Haritonenko
@lazybird560843 · Jan 12, 2026 9:01 am

the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here That part stands out. This probably isn’t the last word on it.

سینا صدر
سینا صدر
@greenkoala416176 · Jan 12, 2026 9:00 am

If you zoom out, this comes across more reactive than planned and that’s what people are responding to That part stands out. That’s just my read on it.

Daniel Hale
Daniel Hale
@blackostrich945606 · Jan 12, 2026 8:57 am

From a neutral view, the timing matters more than people admit Time will tell. Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Marcia Garrett
Marcia Garrett
@crazylion542529 · Jan 12, 2026 8:53 am

At first glance, this feels like a half-step, not a full move and that’s where the disagreement starts That’s what makes this interesting. Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Yasemin Avan
Yasemin Avan
@happyrabbit282461 · Jan 12, 2026 8:51 am

I get the idea, this reads stronger on paper than in practice and that’s why opinions are all over the place That’s the key detail here. Feels like an opening move, not an ending.

Nicásio Duarte
Nicásio Duarte
@purplekoala796754 · Jan 12, 2026 8:40 am

Looking at this, the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here which makes the reaction pretty predictable Interested to see the follow-up.

Luke Kumar
Luke Kumar
@blackkoala897877 · Jan 12, 2026 8:40 am

At this point, the timing matters more than people admit and that friction is hard to ignore

Gunnar Westbye
Gunnar Westbye
@tinygorilla127680 · Jan 12, 2026 8:38 am

the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here which is why this is getting picked apart Let’s see what happens next.

Léonie Francois
Léonie Francois
@greenduck543551 · Jan 12, 2026 8:36 am

the follow-through is what will decide this That’s just how it reads to me. Others will probably see it differently.

Chloe Alvarez
Chloe Alvarez
@lazyladybug146247 · Jan 12, 2026 8:36 am

Looking at this, there’s a lot said here but not much clarified and that’s the part people are stuck on That’s the impression it gives me.

Lauri Polon
Lauri Polon
@whiteswan470489 · Jan 12, 2026 8:36 am

To be fair, the direction makes sense but the details are messy That part stands out. That’s just my read on it.

Volkan Koç
Volkan Koç
@sadleopard992489 · Jan 12, 2026 8:35 am

At first glance, the follow-through is what will decide this which is why the comments look the way they do That part stands out.

Đurađ Stojković
Đurađ Stojković
@heavylion479384 · Jan 12, 2026 8:34 am

I get the idea, the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here and that’s where people will push back That’s what changes the context. At least from my perspective.

Ömür Özkara
Ömür Özkara
@smallleopard360419 · Jan 12, 2026 8:34 am

Looking at this, the logic is there, but the execution is uneven and that tension shows up immediately That’s the impression it gives me.

Faustine Robin
Faustine Robin
@blacklion427263 · Jan 12, 2026 8:33 am

Trying to be fair, the timing matters more than people admit and that’s where it gets complicated That part stands out.

Steffen Dagestad
Steffen Dagestad
@organicfish665625 · Jan 12, 2026 8:32 am

the main issue seems to be how this is handled which explains why reactions are split At least from my perspective.

Lachlan Evans
Lachlan Evans
@yellowduck716652 · Jan 12, 2026 8:32 am

Without overthinking it, the wording alone shifts how people read this This probably isn’t the last word on it. Others will probably see it differently.

Justina Wensveen
Justina Wensveen
@blackdog947323 · Jan 12, 2026 8:24 am

Not gonna lie, the logic is there, but the execution is uneven and that’s what people are responding to That part stands out. We’ll see how people react over time.

Mark Hudson
Mark Hudson
@purplemouse601305 · Jan 12, 2026 8:23 am

the direction makes sense but the details are messy That part stands out. Hard to say where this lands long term. That’s the impression it gives me.

Osmomisla Smal-Stockiy
Osmomisla Smal-Stockiy
@happyswan193980 · Jan 12, 2026 8:23 am

the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here which turns this into more of a debate Feels like there’s more coming here.

Israel Ocampo
Israel Ocampo
@goldencat255898 · Jan 12, 2026 8:23 am

there’s a lot said here but not much clarified That’s the impression it gives me.

Lotta Rautio
Lotta Rautio
@crazygoose597379 · Jan 12, 2026 8:23 am

Stepping back, the way this is presented changes how it lands and that’s what people are responding to At least from my perspective.

Florence Williams
Florence Williams
@browndog389809 · Jan 12, 2026 8:23 am

I get the idea, the idea isn’t bad, but the delivery is doing damage and that friction is hard to ignore That part stands out.

Iván Ramírez
Iván Ramírez
@whiteelephant110764 · Jan 12, 2026 8:22 am

Looking at this, the direction makes sense but the details are messy and that’s where the disagreement starts That’s the key detail here. That’s just how it reads to me.

Anette Fritzsche
Anette Fritzsche
@sadmouse639328 · Jan 12, 2026 8:22 am

Just reading this, this reads stronger on paper than in practice which is why this is getting picked apart That part stands out. We’ll see how people react over time.

Afanasiya Yablonska
Afanasiya Yablonska
@happylion527608 · Jan 12, 2026 8:22 am

this reads stronger on paper than in practice and that’s what people are responding to That’s what changes the context.

سارا نجاتی
سارا نجاتی
@smallgoose897858 · Jan 12, 2026 8:22 am

From the outside, the follow-through is what will decide this and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone That’s the key detail here. We’ll see how people react over time.

Alexis Walker
Alexis Walker
@happydog177542 · Jan 12, 2026 8:21 am

Not gonna lie, this solves one problem while creating another and that’s where people will push back Interested to see the follow-up. That’s just my read on it.

Shravya Chiplunkar
Shravya Chiplunkar
@ticklishmouse864824 · Jan 12, 2026 8:21 am

From a practical angle, the follow-through is what will decide this We’ll see how people react over time. That’s just my read on it.

Karolina Philippe
Karolina Philippe
@orangefrog179928 · Jan 12, 2026 8:20 am

this solves one problem while creating another and that’s where people will push back That’s just my read on it.

بردیا نكو نظر
بردیا نكو نظر
@whiterabbit521226 · Jan 12, 2026 8:20 am

Not gonna lie, this feels more about execution than intent That’s what makes this interesting. Curious how this plays out.

Diane Owens
Diane Owens
@sadostrich433124 · Jan 12, 2026 8:20 am

If we’re being honest, the way this is presented changes how it lands and that tension shows up immediately That’s what makes this interesting. Time will tell.

Clarice Souza
Clarice Souza
@purplesnake190597 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

this reads stronger on paper than in practice

Asta Jørgensen
Asta Jørgensen
@happyfrog379198 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

At this point, this reads stronger on paper than in practice Feels like there’s more coming here.

Eemil Kokko
Eemil Kokko
@orangetiger399300 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

If we’re being honest, the signal is clear, the strategy less so and that tension shows up immediately That part stands out. That’s just my read on it.

Milosav Erceg
Milosav Erceg
@lazydog728533 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

From the outside, this depends heavily on what happens next and that’s where people will push back

Bella Odaynik
Bella Odaynik
@smallbutterfly117419 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

From where I sit, the wording alone shifts how people read this which is why this is getting picked apart That’s what changes the context. Curious how this plays out. That’s the impression it gives me.

Debbie Collins
Debbie Collins
@crazylion504628 · Jan 12, 2026 8:19 am

there’s a gap between the message and the outcome and that’s the part people are stuck on That’s the impression it gives me.

Maelya Dufour
Maelya Dufour
@smallkoala221292 · Jan 12, 2026 8:18 am

At first glance, the way this is presented changes how it lands and that friction is hard to ignore Hard to say where this lands long term.

Nastasija Golubović
Nastasija Golubović
@smallkoala203376 · Jan 12, 2026 8:18 am

the direction makes sense but the details are messy That’s the impression it gives me.

Sharon Castro
Sharon Castro
@crazybear674361 · Jan 12, 2026 8:18 am

this feels like a half-step, not a full move That part stands out. That’s just my read on it.

Theo Thompson
Theo Thompson
@yellowlion293540 · Jan 12, 2026 8:17 am

Honestly, the idea isn’t bad, but the delivery is doing damage which turns this into more of a debate That’s the key detail here.

Matilda Elton
Matilda Elton
@bigzebra626119 · Jan 12, 2026 8:17 am

Stepping back, the timing matters more than people admit and that’s the part people are stuck on

Gaëtan Thomas
Gaëtan Thomas
@heavyladybug108706 · Jan 12, 2026 8:17 am

Honestly, this reads stronger on paper than in practice That’s the key detail here. Curious how this plays out.

Tom Soto
Tom Soto
@greenbird970990 · Jan 12, 2026 8:17 am

From where I sit, the logic is there, but the execution is uneven which is why this is getting picked apart Let’s see what happens next.

Eemeli Suomi
Eemeli Suomi
@blackfish212434 · Jan 12, 2026 8:17 am

there’s a gap between the message and the outcome

Elijah Lewis
Elijah Lewis
@happybear641235 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

Not gonna lie, this depends heavily on what happens next That’s the key detail here. Others will probably see it differently.

Andrea Jørgensen
Andrea Jørgensen
@organicbear465936 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

the signal is clear, the strategy less so and that’s where it gets complicated Interested to see the follow-up. At least from my perspective.

Dolores Perry
Dolores Perry
@angryfish149152 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

this solves one problem while creating another and that tension shows up immediately Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Eleazar Rodrigues
Eleazar Rodrigues
@crazybutterfly884135 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

If we’re being honest, the main issue seems to be how this is handled and that friction is hard to ignore That’s what changes the context. Not convinced this is settled yet.

Gordyata Dupliy
Gordyata Dupliy
@crazypeacock715496 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

From a neutral view, the follow-through is what will decide this and that tension shows up immediately We’ll see how people react over time.

Ülkü Karaböcek
Ülkü Karaböcek
@purpleladybug721727 · Jan 12, 2026 8:16 am

Stepping back, the direction makes sense but the details are messy

Andreja Vilotić
Andreja Vilotić
@ticklishgoose528874 · Jan 12, 2026 8:15 am

On the surface, the timing matters more than people admit That’s what changes the context. Curious how this plays out. That’s the impression it gives me.

Judy Lord
Judy Lord
@ticklishbear818656 · Jan 12, 2026 8:15 am

If we’re being honest, this depends heavily on what happens next That’s what changes the context. Feels like there’s more coming here. That’s the impression it gives me.

Sedef Dağlaroğlu
Sedef Dağlaroğlu
@orangewolf335461 · Jan 12, 2026 8:15 am

there’s a lot said here but not much clarified and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone Feels like an opening move, not an ending. At least from my perspective.

William Hudson
William Hudson
@brownlion119372 · Jan 12, 2026 8:15 am

From a neutral view, the wording alone shifts how people read this That’s what makes this interesting. That’s just how it reads to me.

Bobby Wheeler
Bobby Wheeler
@smallgoose408888 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Stepping back, this comes across more reactive than planned and that’s where people will push back That part stands out.

Simona Wende
Simona Wende
@brownsnake332955 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

the follow-through is what will decide this and that’s the part people are stuck on Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Sofia Castillo
Sofia Castillo
@heavyzebra802599 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

From where I sit, the idea isn’t bad, but the delivery is doing damage and that’s where it gets complicated That’s the key detail here. Feels like an opening move, not an ending.

Lea Nielsen
Lea Nielsen
@smallgorilla715445 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Trying to be fair, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone That’s just my read on it.

Leonard Romero
Leonard Romero
@browncat353581 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Honestly, the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here That’s what makes this interesting. Not convinced this is settled yet.

سام محمدخان
سام محمدخان
@whitecat742717 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Putting bias aside, the signal is clear, the strategy less so and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone Not convinced this is settled yet.

Elias Wiita
Elias Wiita
@greenpeacock155683 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

From my side, this feels like a half-step, not a full move which turns this into more of a debate

Poppy Anderson
Poppy Anderson
@tinygoose552323 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

this comes across more reactive than planned That’s just my read on it.

Claire Anderson
Claire Anderson
@brownfish409864 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Putting bias aside, there’s a lot said here but not much clarified which is why the comments look the way they do At least from my perspective.

Sina Eikemo
Sina Eikemo
@goldencat221454 · Jan 12, 2026 8:14 am

Putting bias aside, the logic is there, but the execution is uneven That’s just how it reads to me. That’s the impression it gives me.

Irene Moreno
Irene Moreno
@crazygorilla950279 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

At first glance, this feels like a half-step, not a full move and that’s the part people are stuck on Curious how this plays out.

Consuelo Reyes
Consuelo Reyes
@heavyswan229546 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

Honestly, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so which turns this into more of a debate That’s what makes this interesting. Feels like an opening move, not an ending. Others will probably see it differently.

Klaus-Peter Weimer
Klaus-Peter Weimer
@brownfish461993 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

At first glance, this comes across more reactive than planned Interested to see the follow-up.

Sara Guajardo
Sara Guajardo
@yellowbird300996 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

Just reading this, there’s a gap between the message and the outcome That’s the key detail here. That’s just my read on it.

Thea Wright
Thea Wright
@lazypeacock989137 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

I get the idea, there’s a gap between the message and the outcome and that’s where the disagreement starts That’s the impression it gives me.

Omar Arnaud
Omar Arnaud
@orangegoose427434 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

If we’re being honest, this feels like a half-step, not a full move and that’s why opinions are all over the place That’s what makes this interesting. Let’s see what happens next.

Yadviga Staruh
Yadviga Staruh
@yellowelephant644982 · Jan 12, 2026 8:13 am

Stepping back, the wording alone shifts how people read this

Jerome Hunter
Jerome Hunter
@tinygoose985873 · Jan 12, 2026 8:12 am

the wording alone shifts how people read this which explains why reactions are split Hard to say where this lands long term. That’s the impression it gives me.

Akseli Mikkola
Akseli Mikkola
@blacksnake133689 · Jan 12, 2026 8:12 am

the wording alone shifts how people read this so the response doesn’t surprise me

محمدامين جعفری
محمدامين جعفری
@lazyzebra324507 · Jan 12, 2026 8:12 am

From a neutral view, the timing matters more than people admit which turns this into more of a debate That’s what changes the context.

Gabrielle Walker
Gabrielle Walker
@crazysnake894354 · Jan 12, 2026 8:12 am

At first glance, the direction makes sense but the details are messy

Peyton Clarke
Peyton Clarke
@redpanda346621 · Jan 12, 2026 8:12 am

From where I sit, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so That’s the key detail here. Feels like an opening move, not an ending.

آراد یاسمی
آراد یاسمی
@sadbird348553 · Jan 12, 2026 8:11 am

Honestly, the wording alone shifts how people read this Others will probably see it differently.

Ema de Souza
Ema de Souza
@goldenrabbit365138 · Jan 12, 2026 8:11 am

From my side, the main issue seems to be how this is handled so the response doesn’t surprise me That part stands out. Not convinced this is settled yet.

Nina Thompson
Nina Thompson
@yellowfrog815538 · Jan 12, 2026 8:11 am

Looking at this, this comes across more reactive than planned and that friction is hard to ignore Hard to say where this lands long term.

Osmomisla Smal-Stockiy
Osmomisla Smal-Stockiy
@happyswan193980 · Jan 12, 2026 8:11 am

there’s a gap between the message and the outcome which makes the reaction pretty predictable Time will tell. Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

Tyra Gijsen
Tyra Gijsen
@greenelephant290369 · Jan 12, 2026 8:11 am

From the outside, the wording alone shifts how people read this and that’s why opinions are all over the place Hard to say where this lands long term.

Villads Møller
Villads Møller
@goldenkoala113961 · Jan 12, 2026 8:10 am

From a practical angle, the main issue seems to be how this is handled and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone That’s the key detail here. Curious how this plays out.

Dharun Shayana
Dharun Shayana
@silverduck758813 · Jan 12, 2026 8:10 am

Real talk, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so and that’s where it gets complicated That’s what changes the context. This could age very differently in a week.

Warren Arnold
Warren Arnold
@redostrich960799 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

this solves one problem while creating another

Frauke Heese
Frauke Heese
@ticklishkoala907253 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

At first glance, the way this is presented changes how it lands which makes the reaction pretty predictable Feels like there’s more coming here. That’s just my read on it.

Svitogor Garan
Svitogor Garan
@purplecat415658 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here and that’s where people will push back That’s what changes the context. This could age very differently in a week.

Ümit Alpuğan
Ümit Alpuğan
@organicrabbit705895 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

Trying to be fair, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so and that’s why opinions are all over the place That part stands out. Others will probably see it differently.

سوگند مرادی
سوگند مرادی
@bigmeercat232955 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

From a neutral view, the framing does a lot of heavy lifting here Curious how this plays out.

Federico Casanova
Federico Casanova
@lazyswan711791 · Jan 12, 2026 8:09 am

From where I sit, the timing matters more than people admit That part stands out. Others will probably see it differently.

Raquel Núñez
Raquel Núñez
@angrycat780421 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

From the outside, the main issue seems to be how this is handled which is why the comments look the way they do Time will tell. Others will probably see it differently.

Maeve Sales
Maeve Sales
@organicostrich395840 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

If we’re being honest, there’s a gap between the message and the outcome and that’s why this won’t land the same for everyone That’s what makes this interesting. Not convinced this is settled yet.

Merian Arnoldus
Merian Arnoldus
@greenostrich667504 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

I get the idea, the wording alone shifts how people read this and that’s why opinions are all over the place That’s what changes the context.

Roberto Navarro
Roberto Navarro
@sadostrich755264 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

If we’re being honest, the signal is clear, the strategy less so and that’s where the disagreement starts That’s just my read on it.

Noelia Molina
Noelia Molina
@silverostrich706292 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

Without overthinking it, the timing matters more than people admit

Harvey Owens
Harvey Owens
@lazymouse255548 · Jan 12, 2026 8:08 am

On the surface, this comes across more reactive than planned and that’s where the disagreement starts Others will probably see it differently.

Kamil Röhrs
Kamil Röhrs
@goldenpanda582260 · Jan 12, 2026 8:07 am

there’s a lot said here but not much clarified which is why this is getting picked apart This probably isn’t the last word on it.

Line Gulli
Line Gulli
@smallmouse467954 · Jan 12, 2026 8:07 am

Just reading this, the follow-through is what will decide this which is why the comments look the way they do

Maëly Francois
Maëly Francois
@lazyostrich237548 · Jan 12, 2026 8:07 am

At this point, the main issue seems to be how this is handled so the response doesn’t surprise me That’s what changes the context.

Silviana Rezende
Silviana Rezende
@greenfish465991 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

If you zoom out, there’s a gap between the message and the outcome Could be wrong, but that’s how it comes across.

آوینا قاسمی
آوینا قاسمی
@sadelephant945286 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

Looking at this, the main issue seems to be how this is handled Feels like there’s more coming here. Others will probably see it differently.

Jack Andersen
Jack Andersen
@purplecat574105 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

If we’re being honest, this solves one problem while creating another which turns this into more of a debate That’s just my read on it.

Eduartino da Mata
Eduartino da Mata
@orangekoala993668 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

From the outside, this feels like a half-step, not a full move which is why this is getting picked apart Curious how this plays out. That’s just my read on it.

Ayşe Yıldırım
Ayşe Yıldırım
@bigduck654267 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

At this point, this depends heavily on what happens next and that’s the part people are stuck on That’s what makes this interesting. This could age very differently in a week. At least from my perspective.

Christel Girard
Christel Girard
@biglion104449 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

this solves one problem while creating another which makes the reaction pretty predictable

Harper Davies
Harper Davies
@orangedog299767 · Jan 12, 2026 8:06 am

Stepping back, the direction makes sense but the details are messy which explains why reactions are split That’s what makes this interesting. At least from my perspective.

Stephanie Ross
Stephanie Ross
@whitegoose640521 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

From my side, the wording alone shifts how people read this and that’s what people are responding to

Antonino Girard
Antonino Girard
@crazyleopard480999 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

Without overthinking it, the intention might be solid, the rollout less so and that tension shows up immediately That’s just my read on it.

Rolando Espinoza
Rolando Espinoza
@crazysnake203308 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

From a neutral view, this feels rushed rather than thought through and that’s where the disagreement starts That’s what makes this interesting.

Aapo Ylitalo
Aapo Ylitalo
@beautifulbird923943 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

Real talk, the signal is clear, the strategy less so which turns this into more of a debate

Carter Sullivan
Carter Sullivan
@beautifultiger398806 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

Honestly, the way this is presented changes how it lands Others will probably see it differently.

Viktor Mogitich
Viktor Mogitich
@brownduck230825 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

To be fair, this reads stronger on paper than in practice At least from my perspective.

Jacob Clark
Jacob Clark
@purplepanda579847 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

this reads stronger on paper than in practice That’s the key detail here.

Aino Anttila
Aino Anttila
@greenlion194235 · Jan 12, 2026 8:05 am

Without overthinking it, this reads stronger on paper than in practice which turns this into more of a debate Hard to say where this lands long term.

Andrea Jørgensen
Andrea Jørgensen
@organicbear465936 · Jan 12, 2026 8:04 am

To be fair, the wording alone shifts how people read this which makes the reaction pretty predictable That’s what makes this interesting.